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Special Called Board of Supervisors Meeting (Friday, April 25, 2025)
Northumberland County, Virginia
Members Present:
James M. Long, Richard F. Haynie, James W. Brann, Chip Williams, AC Fisher, Jr.
Other Staff Present:
Mr. Luttrell Tadlock, County Administrator
Mr. Drew Basye, Assistant County Administrator
Ms. Mary Dodson, Bookkeeper & Benefits Administrator
Mr. Carl Hayden, IT Technician
1. Call to Order
Procedural: A. Call To Order 4:30 p.m.
The special meeting was convened by Chairman Haynie and held at the
Northumberland Courthouse located at 220 Judicial Place, Heathsville, VA 22473.
2. County Administrator Items
Action, Information: A. School Division FY25 Budget Transfer Request
Dr. Leslie, acting Superintendent, explained that they are requesting a transfer from Instruction to Technology in order to cover payroll expenses for three employees. Dr. Leslie did some research and stated that there had been an issue since July 2024 where the accounts were not reconciled correctly so there was a deficit in the technology account, so when payroll was run through the system there was inadequate funding in that account.
Supervisor Fisher asked if this same issue happened a few months back.
Dr. Leslie stated to her understanding yes, but it was a different account, however it did relate to payroll. She explained that she wasn’t a part of those conversations, but to her understanding there were several categories including the federal CARES, federal funds and a special allocations account that they were drawing down using payroll expenses thinking
reimbursements would come in from the federal government or the special allocations, but they hadn't balanced those accounts, so they were drawing negative. Dr. Leslie stated that this is a different situation as there was money placed in the technology account; however, there were invoices submitted in July 2024 that the school was accounting for those invoices to be paid out of the 23-24 budget, but they were submitted in July, so they were held against the 24-25 budget.
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She stated essentially, there was $885,000 worth of invoices that were submitted in July that were held against this year’s budget and the school was looking at them as being held against the previous year's budget so there’s an $885,000 offset.
Supervisor Williams stated that this should have left a surplus of $885,000 in the previous year’s budget.
Dr. Leslie stated in theory that is correct, but there was overspending of the 23-24 budget. Supervisor Williams asked for a play-by-play of events that happened this week that got us to where we are tonight.
Dr. Leslie explained that she received a call from the finance department when they were trying to submit payroll. She stated that payroll comes out of different categories and when the department went to finalize payroll it kicked back that it would have caused a negative value in the technology category, so they investigated what would cause this to happen. She explained that she and the Finance Department met with the County Administrator and some ladies from the Treasurer’s Office to try to understand why that number was negative and that's how they discovered the $885,000 worth of invoices. The County had those listed in the 24-25 budget and the school had it in the 23-24 budget. Dr. Leslie stated that it clearly was not adequately reconciled so that they knew exactly what was in their account. She explained there were three individuals they had to back out of technology so that we could run the payroll for the rest of the division. There was enough to pay one employee from the technology category. Dr. Leslie stated the solution would be trying to move money from the instruction category to technology in order to cover that and for that that they needed to have School Board approval which they were able to get last evening with a special called meeting and then to request the same transfer from the Board of Supervisors tonight to cover that expense.
Supervisor Williams stated that it’s his understanding that there are four people that are paid out of the technology.
Dr. Leslie stated that there are four paid from technology but there was about $11,000 in that account so there was enough to pay at least one employee.
Supervisor Willaims stated so the other three employees are waiting for this transfer. Dr. Leslie stated yes they are waiting for this transfer. She explained that if she’s able to get the transfer approved, she has checks ready for them outside in the parking lot so we can get a paycheck in the employee’s hands as soon as possible.
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Vice Chairman Brann stated that he finds it interesting that the $885,000 was played with so obviously the 23 budget was overspent. He stated the school carried the invoices over to the next year, so it doesn’t look like their budget was overspent.
Dr. Leslie stated to her understanding the intention was for the invoices to go to the 23-24 budget, but unfortunately that’s how it ended up in the accounts.
Chairman Haynie stated that the Finance Director knew about this quite a few months ago. Dr. Leslie stated based on some emails that she’s read, the regular Finance Director was aware that the amount was not reconciling and she’s unsure if there was a plan in place to deal with that it was not reconciled because that individual is not here at the moment. She explained that the Interim Finance Director was not aware.
Chairman Haynie stated the Interim Finance Director was aware of the shortage of funds in the account.
Dr. Leslie stated that they did receive copies of the statements of accounts that showed that it was under that amount, yes sir.
Chairman Haynie stated and yet that person waited until the last minute to say anything. He stated that he’s not blaming Dr. Leslie, but the School Board members should be here to answers questions tonight and they are not. Chairman Haynie stated this is poor accountability, there is no accounting in that office one bit, and he doesn’t think they know where their last dollar was spent a minute ago. He brought attention to the Instruction cateogry dropping way over a million in just one day.
Dr. Leslie stated that the drop in that category is due to the payroll they just submitted. Chairman Haynie stated that he doesn’t want to see anyone not be paid, but the Board’s standing on checks written in the red is a flat no on any account and the Treasurer did her job to stop it because this has been going on for too long and it’s finally being corrected. He stated that the reconciling of accounts is not done monthly and probably not even done quarterly. Dr. Leslie stated that it has not been done monthly, but they now have a plan in place that she’s met with the Interim Finance Director on and they will be going by the County funds and will be reconciling them weekly prior to any payments being requested.
Vice Chairman Brann asked when payroll hits once it is submitted. He asked if the money should already be in the accounts of those who got paid.
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Dr. Leslie stated that it should be, yes.
Vice Chairman Brann stated that he’s received a few concerns from individuals that their pay is still “pending” aside from the three employees who did not get paid from technology. Dr. Leslie stated that she doesn’t know enough about the banks and how their timing works but the ladies did attempt to put the payroll in on Wednesday evening. That is when they discovered there was an error, because if there is a single error in that payroll, they can't do any of it. Vice Chairman Brann stated so it may have been a bank issue.
Supervisor Williams asked if the transfer request is enough to cover the four employees in the technology department for the remainder of the fiscal year.
Dr. Leslie explained that it is not. The short they have to cover payroll only in that account line is $22,388.69. She stated they requested $50,000 because there are invoices that are coming in that are going to hit the technology account. Dr. Leslie explained that she went through all the account balances she received from the County Administrator and then came up with some rough estimates of what it will look like for the rest of the fiscal year. So, to answer Mr. Williams’ question, no, they’re going to have to request several (at least five or six) transfers between categories in order to make sure that they balance out for the rest of the year. Chairman Haynie asked if all the money would be coming out of the instruction category. Dr. Leslie informed the Board that they will need to move money into the instruction category eventually to continue the payrolls and the general expenses. She stated please know that she did ballpark figures based on the reports that she could find. She stated that the Interim Finance Director and she have a lot of work to do to get this clarified and to get transfers together. The reason for requesting this amount was to make sure they were able to get employees paid expediently and to ensure they have enough without having to come back next week if an invoice were to come in that they have to pay. She stated that these are rough estimates and she doesn’t have access to all this information in order to provide the Board with exact numbers. Supervisor Fisher asked what Dr. Leslie does not have access to.
Dr. Leslie explained that she is not trained in the accounting system because she does not work in finance. She stated she often runs report from the system but she’ll have to work with the finance department so she’ll know what she needs to do adjust her figures to provide to the Board.
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Supervisor Williams asked if there is any reason to believe that expenditures for May and June in the instruction category would be drastically higher.
Dr. Leslie stated no. That’s why when she calculated them out, she used the average. The only caveat as she stated is going to be the second payroll run in June that pays out the 10 and a half month and the 11-month employees because they are paid out of the previous year's budget whereas the 12-month employees would be paid out of the new year's budget.
Supervisor Williams stated if Dr. Leslie can estimate what the expenditures are going to be in Instruction for the next coming months, shouldn’t someone in the finance department have known what the expenditures were going to be last month before we got to the point that the checks were taken to the Treasurer.
Chairman Haynie stated that the biggest question is are the schools going to have enough money to cover everything for this year without going into the red.
Dr. Leslie stated that she wishes she could give a direct answer, but she has not been able to meet with all the directors. Based on the projections that she’s put together, she responded no. Vice Chairman Brann stated that he much rather her research it and come back with something more solid.
Dr. Leslie stated it is really going to take a lot of time for her to dig into it and do it right. She explained that it’s going to require getting numbers from the system, getting back numbers from the County of what the school has spent historically and then trying to base her numbers on those, as well as finding out if there are any large bills that are coming in that aren’t accounted for. She stated that she would need at least a week to research this because she also has to get the budget out the door.
Chairman Haynie asked if she could have it finalized by their next Board of Supervisors meeting. Dr. Leslie agreed, stating that this would hopefully allow them to put something together and to request from their Board what monies they need to move around.
Motion to approve a transfer of funds from 30-6000-6100 (Instruction) to 30-6000-6800 (Technology) in the amount of $50,000.00 for the School Division.
Motion by: Richard F. Haynie, second by: James M. Long.
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Final Resolution: Motion Carried
Aye: James M. Long, Richard F. Haynie, James W. Brann, Chip Williams, AC Fisher, Jr. Vice Chairman Brann stated for the record that when referencing Mrs. Booth, the Board is not referring to Mrs. Donna Booth who worked for the School System years ago and is now retired. He doesn’t want her to take any heat from any of the things going on.
Chairman Haynie asked Dr. Leslie if she could provide them with all the salaries of teacher, stipends, and what kind of pay scale it is. He would like to see all the salaries they are getting paid and why.
Action, Information: B. Regional Jail Board FY26 Budget
County Administrator Tadlock explained that the Northern Neck Regional Jail approved their FY26 budget in the amount of $13,846,630.00 (operating budget) and there is no cost to the localities. Provided in the Board’s packet is the revenues, expenditures, and also significant points in relation to the budget.
Motion to approve the Northern Neck Regional Jail Board Budget as presented in the amount of 13,846,630.00.
Motion by: Richard F. Haynie, second by: James M. Long.
Final Resolution: Motion Carried
Aye: James M. Long, Richard F. Haynie, James W. Brann, Chip Williams, AC Fisher, Jr. Action, Information: C. Vehicle Surplus Correction
Motion to amend action taken at the February 13, 2025, regular meeting to reflect the surplus of a 2019 Ford Interceptor, VIN 9164, instead of the 2017 Ford Interceptor.
Motion by: Chip Williams, second by: AC Fisher, Jr.
Final Resolution: Motion Carried
Aye: James M. Long, Richard F. Haynie, James W. Brann, Chip Williams, AC Fisher, Jr. Vice Chairman Brann asked Dr. Curran, School Board member, if he could share any information if any steps have been taken related to his request that the Superintendent and Finance Director remain on leave without pay during the investigation.
Dr. Curran stated that he has not received any information on any steps being taken.
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Vice Chairman Brann finds it disappointing that apparently individuals aren’t doing a good job, but he bets they got paid today and they’ll get one next month too, yet other employees are not receiving their paychecks. He stated that some of the shortage that they’re going to need at the end of the year to pay for some of this stuff could be part of their salaries if they get put on leave with pay and he is having trouble swallowing that pill. He stated this has been going on for quite some time and if it hadn’t been for a group of citizens standing and speaking up, it would still be happening.
Dr. Curran explained that he found out about this incident on Wednesday, and he went back and apologized on behalf of the School Board to each employee and took responsibility for it. Chairman Haynie stated that the ladies in the finance department knew about it much longer than that and yet they keep sitting on it while the School Board keeps covering for them, but this Board is being blamed for their actions. He stated that it’s not the Board’s fault they don’t know how to manage money.
Dr. Curran stated that it all comes down to responsibility and trust.
Chairman Haynie agreed and thanked Dr. Curran for stepping up and trying to get the trust back and being transparent with the Board because they don’t have that with anyone else. He stated that all the comments the Board receives are how terrible a job they are doing, but it’s not their fault the money is not spent correctly. It's not their fault that they end every program. The school’s student to teacher ratio is a 9:1 and yet the grade scores are steadily declining, and the school keeps dumping money into it which does not work. It needs to be changed whether they lose some people, increase teacher to student ratio, and to cut the budget back because the taxpayers are the ones who feel the burden and the students are the ones who are not getting an education.
Supervisor Long stated that some students didn’t have a teacher at all and were working on their computers.
Chairman Haynie stated that they never hear reports of anything that is going on in the school. They don't even want anyone to know what they're spending money on and that's not right. It’s taxpayer dollars that they're spending, and everybody has a right to know what they're spending it on and where it's going. Chairman Haynie believes those accounts need to be open to the public.
Supervisor Fisher stated that people think that the Board of Supervisors can tell the school how to spend their money.
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Chairman Haynie explained that the Board cannot tell them how to spend the money. The Board appropriates money in their categories because they don’t know how to spend it and then the school switches it back and forth from category to category without notifying the Board. Vice Chairman Brann stated that they have three people in the School Board Office right now that have been put into a bad situation and they are the two finance ladies and the acting Superintendent.
Dr. Curran stated that every motion he makes is to benefit the children and he apologized for not taking actions sooner. He explained that he wanted to get a full grasp of what was going on at the schools.
Chairman Haynie opened the floor for public comment.
Ms. Lynn Stuart explained that the problem with all this is that last year the Board gave the school a majority of the money they wanted and said, "How do you want to spend it?" She stated the Board allowed the school to put it in categories and to determine where the money was going. She stated that she doesn’t want to hear that this is a problem for the Board of Supervisors because it isn't. The Board compromised and it was up to them to manage that money, and they didn't. Ms. Stuart explained that the Board specifically worded their motion to make sure that salaries and benefits for teachers and staff were covered.
Chairman Haynie agreed with Ms. Stuart and stated the Board approved enough money for all teachers and all employees’ salaries with their raises and their medical benefits, but he doesn’t know where it’s gone.
Dr. Karen Pica stated that there is a serious problem with the budget according to the documentation provided at the School Board meeting two weeks ago. There was $102,000 in the technology account to cover salary and benefits but if you look at the April 14th documents provided to the School Board from the Finance Director there was $77,000 for personnel/salary and $22,000-$23,000 in benefits. Dr. Pica stated that they have been told at every School Board meeting for this year and at every Board of Supervisors meeting that the school was reconciling with the County. She stated that reconciling does not mean you agree to your number, and I agree to mine. It means they match, and it is impossible to have $77,000 in a salary account two weeks ago and have it all disappear. She applauded Dr. Leslie for coming forward and saying, "Oops there was a problem." Dr. Pica believes the Board is looking at a hole of $1.2 million without even considering what needs to be moved or changed for payroll all because of errors are simple math. Dr. Pica offered her assistance to Dr. Leslie to help finalize numbers to present to the Board if she is allowed to do so legally.
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Mrs. Tina Withers, Interim Finance Director, commented online and stated that she wasn't able to be present at the meeting because she was still over in the office trying to get some vendor payments processed today. She wanted the Board to know that she is trying to work with Dr. Leslie. She stated that her name, as well as Shannon O’Bier’s, keeps getting thrown out there and all of this was just dumped onto them, and they are trying to do the best they can. She stated it's upsetting because they weren't even aware of some of the numbers, and it’s being misconceived as if they were. She explained that Tara Booth did not share this type of information with Shannon or her, who are over there currently trying to deal with these issues since February. Mrs. Withers wanted to make it clear that she is working with Dr. Leslie and trying to figure these things out and when she took the payroll over to the Treasurer’s office she was just as surprised.
Chairman Haynie thanked her for her comments but stated that he’d still like to see Mrs. Withers be present at the meetings to tell the Board that it’s not her fault when these issues come up. Mrs. Withers stated that she doesn’t mind coming to the meetings, but she had something that needed to be submitted by 5:00p.m. today so she was working on that. She explained that Shannon and herself are feeling beat up by this and they’re doing their best but some of this information was not shared with them.
Supervisor Williams asked if there was any way that she or anyone else in the finance department would have known that those checks were not going to clear before they went to the Treasurer’s Office that day.
Mrs. Withers stated that no they were just as in shock when they took the payroll over. Ms. Coultrip asked what the public should expect from the state police investigation and suggested that the Board look at what credit cards have been issued to the school and to which employees. She also asked who hires the employees and who has the power to fire the employees that are suspected for being responsible for the accounting issues.
Chairman Haynie informed Ms. Coultrip that the school and County are separate. The school has the power to hire or fire any employee in the school system. As far as the investigation goes, he’s unsure what’s going to happen yet. Chairman Haynie stated they’re going to have a meeting with the state police to determine where they want to go, and then they’re going to have another meeting with both Boards.
Ms. Coultrip stated so the School Board is holding the taxpayers hostage and that’s outrageous. She stated that she was at a previous meeting where Dr. Pica volunteered to be a part of a citizens oversight Board and she thinks that needs to continue.
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Vice Chairman Brann stated that they did form the Joint Finance Committee, and they did have several meetings and that committee is still ongoing.
Ms. Coultrip stated it is maybe time for a special election for new School Board members. Dr. Wargo apologized and stated that her father passed away. She believes that she has worked so hard in Northumberland to represent the County and it’s destroying her the way the Board has handled things. She stated that she doesn’t know what’s happened since she’s been gone but she will try to catch up. She requested the Board to be civil and help her through these issues. Chairman Haynie apologized for the loss of her dad and stated he believed that she was on FMLA leave.
Dr. Wargo stated that she doesn’t believe that needs to be announced right now.
Ms. Kathy Rock asked why people who aren’t doing their jobs are still getting paid. She stated at any other job, you get fired. She also stated that she hopes the state police will do criminal background checks on all the school board members and that those results be made public. Ms. Kelly Stuart wants the Board to know that the community believes the Board has done what they can do, but they are very frustrated because they don’t get straight answers from the School Board. If it comes down to having to hire somebody from outside to come in and do an investigation, then that's what needs to be done. She stated she’s as sorry as she can be if someone is going through hard times, but that doesn't excuse the two-three years that it's been a problem.
Mr. Maurice Johnson stated that at this point it's impossible to avoid the appearance that a crime has been committed. He stated that he won’t point fingers at anybody but he has a hard time swallowing the notion that the problems that have been going on for several years now are all based on accidents. He sent his condolences to Dr. Wargo, but he believes that she needs to understand that this County wants accountability and that was her responsibility for years. Mr. Andrew Wiley believes there needs to be a line drawn between the two Boards because the line has been blurred between who's responsible for what. He stated that they as citizens can petition in the court to remove these School Board members and maybe that needs to happen. Mr. Wiley apologized to the Board for having to deal with this and feels that drawing a line of distinction between responsibilities may clear up some of the confusion.
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Ms. Denise Steel wonders how all this has happened for this many years and how nobody was held accountable for it. She asked why it took so long for anyone to find out about these issues. Chairman Haynie stated this has been going on for quite a few years and they’re trying to hold people accountable now. He explained that the County and the School Board are two separate entities, and they could only find out the information that the School Board is willing to give them.
3. Closing of Meeting
Action: A. Adjournment
Motion to adjourn.
Motion by: James M. Long, second by: Chip Williams.
Final Resolution: Motion Carried
Aye: James M. Long, Richard F. Haynie, James W. Brann, Chip Williams, AC Fisher, Jr.